OK @Tut apologies. I stand corrected as far as Australia goes.
Nevertheless, in our Macedonian VAT law, and Tax Office requirements and interpretation as I stated above this requirements is a must:
- Tax must be stated per line, no matter if it is only one line, no matter if it is 100 lines with same %.
- Tax base subtotals must be divided bu Tax % in case of multiple tax. Only VAT % subtotals is not enough.
I want to revisit this topic because I think Manager needs more flexibility how invoices should be presented. Custom themes are not solution to meet legal requirements. That should be core feature.
I’d challenge this and say that if invoice has one line, then tax doesn’t have to be shown on that line since any tax visible on invoice is on that line. It cannot be on anything else.
I doubt any tax authority in the word would insist on particular presentation like
Tax amount must be horizontally aligned with
Except double-entry accounting systems do not calculate tax like that. Tax amount is calculated on each line seperately, rounded and then added up.
From what I can see, we need to add checkbox so
Tax amount can be shown on each line item.
Generally I agree with this. However, it is interpreted here that it should.
Tax amount is calculated on each line seperately, rounded and then added up.
This is not about calculation but about presentation.
Here is a good example of how an invoice should look with these fields. This is field 5.
That being said there are definitely different looking invoices, but they all seem to have these features.
Example: this is telecom operator invoice
It has both per line information and the subtotals below (вкупно фактурирано in this case).
I can probably find other examples.
If we get close to this it will be awesome.
I have nothing to add more than @novica already said. I could only add some more examples:
And the closest I managed to get there through enormous theme modification and calculations inside
With one VAT code
It is preaty good but involves as I said to much hack, that could be changed in future exposed variables,
But here is with multiple VAT codes. Problem is that 0% VAT is nowhere exposed and I cannot properly separate in totals. So here is test invoice vith all VAT codes
I would also like to have some oportunity to generate Amounts in words in local language, but
That limitation originates with the software command, which returns the result in English. Manager’s translations are based on a lookup table of terms in the program.
There are solutions possibilities. For example lookup table, for numbers, currencies etc… We already have translations, maybe just adding lookup for that command. Maybe a liquid filter of some sort, I haven’t thought it a lot, but there must be possibilities.
Number translations are not that straight forward. Many languages have their unique number system and on top of that there might be lots of exceptions.
I think that might require users to contribute with code and not just translations.
It was just an idea. And yes if there is possibility to add code to do that, it is another solution, so users could contribute.
IN the moment no one except English speaking users can use this function.
The latest version (20.8.98) will show
Tax Amount column if checkbox
Amounts are tax inclusive is unchecked. This works only on receipts and payments. But since receipts and payments work almost the same as invoices, you can have a look how it is implemented.
I think that there should be another column before the last 2 columns with heading “Amount excl.tax” and these last three columns all have totals. Also rename last column to “Amount incl.tax”.
OK, it shows Tax Amount, but not much help at the moment. 3 things I will comment:
If we use new feature there are no subtotals at the end, just one TOTAL.
As I understand and worked, checkbox Amounts are tax inclusive til this change, has nothing to do with real VAT calculations. This is how we used it. It depends how we like to choose to enter data (with or without tax) and according to TAX code chosen manager calculates real unit price. This doesn’t need to be changed because it will make changes to already entered documents. Maybe it will be better to have a new checkbox Show Tax Amount as Column (or similar).
Here is by our law how should one invoice look like (closest I managed to do with custom theme, calculations inside, and heavy customization and looping through tables exposed inside). I translated to English so you could get real feeling what have we asked for with @novica. Please Take a look at lines items, but also Totals section.
Preview Screen (Unit Price = E.M. My custom field for defining line item Unit Names)
Please feel free to comment, and I will also share with you the theme if needed so you could see what I was doing. Also When Invoice has only one VAT %, some fields are missing, so the whole thing is breaking apart, so I have 2 wersions of theme (for 1 VAT code, and for Multiple VAT codes). I am in the process of putting all in one theme with lots and lots of IF_THENs and Loops
Maybe the best will be if we have all amounts and columns exposed in custom forms (Unit Amount, Vat %, Vat Amount, Unit with VAT, Line Totals With and without Tax, etc…, Also totals with and without VAT per VAT Code, and then we can choose in custom theme what we want to show. That way maybe default themes can stay the same, and only users that need this kind of display with code custom themes as they like it. So the exposed data should be always the same (as much as possible), always same structure no matter how many VAT codes or line numbers invoice has, and users should build there invoice as they need. Also column order change now is very difficult (I have done it, but is not easy).
Maybe some invoice builder (visual or something like custom reports), just an idea, a long-shot one
This is not true. Your NEW example either has no tax codes applied or is not a receipt or payment.
This is also not true. Manager calculated the tax amount regardless of whether the transaction was tax-inclusive or tax-exclusive. The difference was in how the tax was calculated. The method of calculation has not changed. Only the display has changed. See https://www.manager.io/guides/9502 for information on the tax calculation methods.
The change only applies to receipts and payments. It has not been implemented on sales invoices. Perhaps it will be, since the developer left the topic in the ideas category.
It is TRUE. It is the same Receipt, with and without Amounts are tax inclusive checked. You can see by your self if you have looked better, that everything else is the same (description, qty, unit price, tax rate). Look better before replying. How can there be VAT column in %, if I didn’t applied tax codes.
But not to talk without proof here you are:
Without “Amounts are tax inclusive” checked
With “Amounts are tax inclusive” checked
Is all OK ?
Again you jump into conclusions. I didn’t said that calculation is changed. I said that if I want new column in display, I will have to set checkbox to unchecked, thus it will change the calculation. Do you agree ? Have a try in old receipt where you had Amounts are tax inclusive checked. Now you want to show Tax Amount column, and therefor you have to uncheck the checkbox. IS IT THE SAME RECEIPT in total? Have you even tried the new function.
Yes, of course, I understand well from Lubos post. Also he said “But since receipts and payments work almost the same as invoices, you can have a look how it is implemented.”. So was just talking to him about implementation, that maybe will be transferred in future to Invoices. As I understood Lubos is testing it like this, on a much benign position in Receipts/Payments than directly in Invoices.
I apologize if I misinterpreted your post, @MarV. It was very confusing. There are several reasons why:
- Although you said one image was OLD and one was NEW, the totals do not match. If they were the same receipt from older and newer program versions, the totals would be the same.
- You did not show enough of the finished transactions to know whether they were receipts, sales invoices, purchase invoices, or something else. You should notice that the topic of this thread is “VAT information on sales invoice.” Since you did not specify what the screen shots were from, there was a chance they were showing sales invoices. In fact, that was one of the possibilities I mentioned.
- You wrote in post #12 that you had made “enormous theme modification and calculations.” Combined with the partial screen shots mentioned in the previous point, that meant I did not know what I was looking at or what your modified theme might be displaying.
- The forum is in English. You could have temporarily changed your language preference so other forum members could interpret what you posted. Whatever language you are using, I can’t read it. So I guessed based on layout.
Your new illustrations at least show the full receipts, so we know what they are. These are clearly tax-inclusive and tax-exclusive for the same input unit prices. That is much different than old and new, which is what you claimed you were showing last time.
Actually, what you said was, “…checkbox Amounts are tax inclusive til this change, has nothing to do with real VAT calculations.” That is what I was saying is not true. The checkbox definitely has everything to do with real VAT calculations, whether it is checked or unchecked. When you change the checkbox, the total changes.
Yes, I agree with this statement. But that is not what you said the first time.
No, because of the change in tax calculation. If you want the same total, you must change the unit prices when switching between inclusive and exclusive pricing. This is why I am able to tell your original two screen shots, labeled as OLD and NEW are not the same transaction. Most likely, one is inclusive and one is exclusive. But with your theme modifications, I cannot be sure.
Ohhhh, you don’t even read or look at photos. Post #12 was about Invoices, but from there down, Lubos told to check Receipts/Payments so OLD/NEW was about that.
But OK. is the Photos previous post of mine same down at Totals section ?
Are they same in my earlier Post, little upper.
NO in both cases, no matter if you don’t understand the language. Both are receipts, both are with tax codes, etc. So either you don’t understand what I em referring to or … (Do you want earlier photos in English ???)
Once again, I was not speaking of Totals as numbers. The look and feel of Totals section display is DIFFERENT. Please see post #21, I have circle it with red, so there was no reason for not understanding what I wanted to say. DISPLAY is not the same in Totals section.
And NO in this case I don’t use custom themes, it is plain, default receipt theme.
And If you said you did extensively tested the option, you are telling me you didn’t notice change in totals section bellow table ?
I never said that.
This back-and-forth over who said what is not productive. Let me try to finish it by saying that the program functions as the developer said it does. If you believe you have identified a case where that does not happen, please illustrate and explain it.
2 posts were split to a new topic: Tax subtotal field missing when a “tax exclusive” Receipt / Payment
Sorry, but may I say how lucky we are here on Norfolk Island, even though we are a part of Australia, we are not required to pay gst on purchases, and likewise we do not charge gst on sales
Thanks for your detailed replies. Would you please share code of your custom theme for sales invoice with vat amount column? Thank