this is my first time that I ‘stumble’ in to the default theme problem. I managed to pursuade a friend to try the Manager, he was excited but wanted to do the invoice in their own way.
With my little knowledge on html, prepared the them to meet his requirements. Now he is frustrated for the same reason reported here:
It’s awkward and easy to make a mistake and send an invoice using the default theme instead of the modified. He will make mistake and send (several times) the default theme invoice which is completely different from the one prepared.
Please do something about it - It is a very reasonable and important request.
Thank you @lubos in advance - you always had a very good approach in problems faced and resolved issues quickly.
@Davide@nichri@Hennie_Groenewald@Glider@acecombat2@rdavidsc
to all the users who requested and are requesting for the ability to set a default theme, @lubos had already mentioned in another topic this would be made available. so please be patient. you cannot expect the man to answer the same thing over and over. please understand this is not the only issue he has to attend to.
I don’t think we are being unreasonable, this thread has been running for 6 months and the other topic mentioned is one line in a post about a different issue so not very likely to be picked up. We all appreciate lubos is busy and his hard work to bring this program to life.
The main issue is that ability to set default theme breaks Manager and I have no solution to this.
Users will set broken themes as default, then they wonder why their invoices look fine and quotes and other views look broken. Or perhaps, custom theme has custom fields hard-coded, then new custom field is created and it doesn’t show on a document even if the correct checkbox on custom field is checked.
There are just too many issues. Users blame the program because they forgot it’s an issue with their custom theme rather than the program itself.
So how to solve this issue? Should Manager contain warning on every screen which has custom theme applied by default? The purpose of the warning would be to make it obvious if something looks broken, then you should check how does the document looks using “Plain” theme to determine whether the issue is to be blamed on custom theme or the program (usually issue is to be blamed on custom theme).
I don’t think any non-it savvy user able to tell what is wrong immediately with the custom template.
May I suggest the warning to be display like tick box (unlock safety mechanism 'activate custom theme) at custom template section. For disclaimer purpose and advise if it does happen what do they do.
Now I think about it, the risk is, it will take extra time to diagnosed the problem whether is being caused by custom template or program or both incompatible.
most users who are able to customize their theme are aware to check their custom theme if something broke after an update. but still there are users who might have got help from a programmer to customize their theme and may blame the program.
having the ability to set a default theme is important too as it would save a lot of time for users who make many invoices a day. they make a custom theme to use it anyway.
so my suggestion would be to,
include a check box in the theme settings where a user can select on which tabs the custom themes should be applied as a default.
show a warning on every form (only) where the custom theme is applied. an example as below.
@lubos, I have avoided expressing my strong support for the ability to set a default custom theme for 6 months. Your recent comments prompt me to break my silence, though.
I disagree with this point of view despite understanding why you feel this way. It isn’t the ability to set a default theme that breaks Manager; it is poor coding by users. Philosophically, once you’ve made the decision to allow custom themes at all, I believe you need to accept that some users will misunderstand and misuse them. That is not only already possible, it happens frequently, just as you say. So trying to protect users from their own coding mistakes has not only proved futile, it is enormously irritating to those who get things right. Keeping the default ability out of the program effectively punishes those who use the feature correctly, yet does not prevent mistakes. Is it right to try to make mistakes a tiny bit harder to produce at the cost of constant user annoyance? I think not. It runs counter to the basic intuitiveness of the program.
This is true. But custom themes are not different from other aspects of the program in this regard. Very few problems mentioned on the forum stem from program bugs. Most are due to user errors or inexperience. The most common solution is to read and follow the Guides.
I don’t think so. That’s going to use valuable screen space and will soon be ignored. How would it be, for example, if Word displayed a warning on every document that failure to periodically save work could result in loss of information in case of power failure?
Perhaps, in place of the Switch Theme▼ button, you could substitute something showing the theme in use, by name. That would be a visual reminder to users and would help troubleshooters on the forum. You could place a verbal warning on the theme-form page so someone sees it when they create or edit a custom theme.
You could also ask forum moderators and regular contributors to more routinely ask about custom themes and whether switching to Plain resolves a problem. By seeing the question often, other participants might be reminded to check first.
To add my perspective.
To deny/punish business efficiency to “all” those users who get their custom templates coded correctly because a few might get it wrong is an ineffective excuse.
Those who are getting it wrong are already lodging forum questions and this volume of questions wont change because a default custom template can be permanently selected. If the user can currently select a custom template and it works effectively then there is no need to deny it as a default setting.
To reiterate “It isn’t the ability to set a default theme that breaks Manager; it is poor coding by users”, and that’s not going to change because default templates are allowed.
So currently, all the users with effectively working custom templates are being punished and have to remain inefficient in their processing because a few users get their initial custom templates coding wrong - but with assistance from the forum these are resolved - and then they will join the increasing number of Manager users who are being frustrated that they can’t set their custom template as default.
Maybe allow to set as default per view, I guess most users want customisation for invoices only.
I think advanced users wouldn’t mind to explicitly set default to the views they need once, rather then changing it all the time and it would keep default plain template for everything else.
I agree. It is really frustrating not to be able to set one’s custom template as default. I have other people in my office adding sales orders and no matter how many times I remind them someone inevitably forgets to use the drop down to select our custom template, so my sales order is left in the wrong format and I have to hope I notice it before it gets sent to a client. Please revert to making the custom template the default as you had done when this issue was first resolved.
any decision taken on this?
it’s obvious from all comments that we all consider it awkward to remember to switch template for every document (invoice etc) created instead of being able to change the default template
