Bank / Cash Account mandatory selection no longer occurs

Prior to the recent multi Bank / Cash tab implementation you couldn’t progress a Receive / Spend transaction without the “mandatory selection” of a related Bank / Cash Account - this aided in preventing Suspense transactions.

This was the initial screen - the account had to be selected before progressing
0000000 Bug 4

But now you can complete a transaction without having to select a bank or cash account:
0000000 Bug 4a

While this is not an actual bug, it is however a reversal in previously implemented transaction controls

Also, if you only have one bank or cash account, could Manager be smart enough to auto-select the appropriate account. (a few less clicks)

Point well made, however currently, if you go via the Bank / Cash Account tab (not the transaction tab) and click on the bank / cash account balance to then select the Receive /Spend, the account will then auto fill - but probably at no less ticks.

Then i would have to write down/remember the invoice number and total amount, enter the payer, select accounts receivable, select customer/payer (again!), then select invoice, then enter the amount. Lots of work!

I always just, click receive money from within the sales invoice, click new cash transaction, click on the cash account, enter description, Done.
Just thought, if you only had one cash or bank account Manager should already know which one to select when you click New cash/bank transaction. Save on that 1 click :grinning:

Ok, hadn’t thought at all about coming from the invoice tabs - nor did your post indicate that was your starting point.

In another topic this issue had come up. But as per Lubos’ statement, creating a transaction without selecting an account was always possible. i have no idea if this is intentional or not. you may check the below post.

Apologies, yes that wasn’t very clear was it.

Anyway, just a suggestion to speed up workflow.

I think that should be - creating a “blank record” was always possible, but not the creation of a transaction as it was mandatory to select a bank / cash account before the transaction could be created

Yes, a blank Invoice can be create (see below), but you can’t create a transaction without the mandatory selection of a Customer, same with Supplier

0000000 Bug 3

Prior to the recent multi Bank / Cash tab implementation you couldn’t progress a Receive / Spend transaction without “the mandatory selection of a” Bank / Cash Account - this aided in preventing Suspense transactions.

PS - have edited the topic heading and the initial post

i am assuming you did not read the topic completely in which Lubos had made the statement which i attached in my earlier reply.

it was not the issue of a blank record. the user had processed the receive money transaction without selecting a bank account.

While there can certainly be further discussion about whether the workflow should be changed, I am removing this topic from the Bugs category.

  • There were always ways to enter bank or cash transactions without specifying the account, just as you have always been able to enter a sales or purchase invoice without specifying the customer or supplier. Such transactions were not visible, so it was almost impossible to track down the error.
  • The former workflow simply had the transaction forms for Spend money and Receive money appearing in progressive stages. Now, they appear in a single stage.
  • If you neglect to choose a cash or bank account, the transaction will be recorded and will be visible in Bank Transactions or Cash Transactions, but with no entry in the Account column. This can be repaired by a simple edit.
  • Thus, the change was deliberate, not a bug.

Yes, you could create a Bank / Cash account less transaction (dummy record) but it couldn’t contain any financial data - similar to the Customer example shown above. When mandatory selection was introduced then the entry of financial data was only possible after the selection of the Bank / Cash account had been made.

Yes, a valueless invoice as illustrated above but not a valued Invoice, i.e. containing financial data.
Perhaps you would like to illustrate where it is currently possible to enter a “valued” sales or purchase invoice without the selection of a Customer / Supplier.

Yes, and those stages added to the proper management / control on data entry, elimination of Suspense entry.

A retrograde step.

Then that change needs to be explain. We are constantly being advised that certain implementations are being done in the name of consistency - i.e. that was part of the justification for the now multi-tab bank / cash tabs release.

So in the name of consistency, we use to have mandatory selection on bank / cash account selections but currently that’s been removed. Currently we still have mandatory selections on Customers & Suppliers, so in the name of consistency are these mandatory selections also to be removed.

The sole point of this topic was to illustrate that a previous control feature has been removed - mandatory selection - which also now makes the programme inconsistent with other tab controls.

Your statement is only true for transactions initiated in the Bank/Cash Accounts tabs. If you initiate a transaction from within a sales or purchase invoice, you can leave the account blank and it defaults to Suspense. This is what I was referring to.

Create a sales or purchase invoice by any means: copy, clone, or from scratch. Enter values. Then delete the supplier or customer. The invoice remains in the tab ledger, although its value does not show and is not reflected on the balance sheet or P&L. But if you edit that invoice and select a customer or supplier, all data is restored and relevant accounts are adjusted. I guess its a matter of semantics. The invoice is certainly present with no customer or supplier. The values of line items are stored, but not acted upon. So is that a “valued” invoice? Who knows.

As for whether @lubos’s justification for this change is adequate, that’s a matter of opinion. You clearly don’t agree. I really don’t have an opinion because incomplete transactions were not a problem for me before the change and they aren’t after the change. The purpose of my comments on that aspect of this issue was to point out that it wasn’t a bug, but a deliberate action. If your recommended reversal is implemented, I won’t care one way or the other.

This is not a bug. The reason why mandatory selection was previously required was that there was no place in Manager to view transactions without bank account or cash account. So bank/cash selection must have been mandatory on that basis.

Now that there is a place where those transactions can be viewed, I took step back and relaxed the rules.

As for whether software should be forcing user to select cash account or bank account, I’m leaning towards yes. On the same basis that users are being forced to select customer or supplier on invoices. It just avoids mess at some later point in the future.

This rule should probably extend to all general ledger transactions (excluding journal entries). E.g. when creating inventory write-off, inventory item should be selected. When creating payslip, employee should be selected etc. It just avoids unnecessary clutter in Suspense account.

I do want to have a look at all forms where it makes sense.

Hear Hear